We Are Liars - A Pretty Little Liars Podcast

WAL 2x11 "I Must Confess"

[00:00:00] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Loved her one liners. What was it? Right? Wipe my dew from my lily.

[00:00:29] ILISSA DALEY: All righty. This was a jam packed episode of Pretty Little Liars. We are Liars podcast. I'm Lyss. And I'm Michelle. And we are discussing season two, episode 11. Titled, I Must Confess, aired August 23, 2011, written by Oliver Goldstick and directed by Norman Buckley. The Liars finally reveal the torment that A has put them through to the one person they can trust outside their group, Dr.

[00:00:59] ILISSA DALEY: [00:01:00] Sullivan. But could she be next on A's target list? Question mark? I'm nervous. Girl, you better be nervous. Oh. I'm

[00:01:10] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: super nervous for her. Until next week. Also, I must confess my loneliness. As soon as you said that, I was like, oh, Brittany.

[00:01:19] ILISSA DALEY: I couldn't remember what this episode title was for every time I did my notes or whatever.

[00:01:24] ILISSA DALEY: And I was like, what's the title again? I could not remember. Yeah. These titles will never just stick in my brain. I don't understand it. They're a little tough. They are. Yeah. All right. What's tough is Emily. This has been a trying week, day, month, year, whatever for her. She cannot sleep. A is tormenting her still.

[00:01:44] ILISSA DALEY: Texting her at three o'clock in the morning a picture of Aria and Ezra kissing and tells Emily that she needs to tell Ella. So Emily's like, I, I gotta go. She leaves her phone home and she runs. Nothing came of [00:02:00] this.

[00:02:01] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: No. A never followed through the

[00:02:03] ILISSA DALEY: threat. Well, I think A was a little preoccupied after figuring out that the girls want to tell Dr.

[00:02:11] ILISSA DALEY: Sullivan that A has been tormenting them. So maybe it still could come out, obviously. Yeah. Um, this is definitely a secret that is a big one that A would love for it to be revealed. So Emily, as I said, at three o'clock in the morning, well actually the text was at three but then it says 515, she's out.

[00:02:32] ILISSA DALEY: Running. Hannah wakes up and Emily is not there. Emily's phone is there so she doesn't understand where she would go without her phone. And so the other girls search the room and they realize that Emily is gone and they get worried so they go to Dr. Sullivan. And then of course we have Emily on her run and she Sullivan's office.

[00:02:53] ILISSA DALEY: She's like, I'm ready to talk. And Dr. Sullivan's like, great. We're all here to talk. It's just a little. It was a little strange. Too [00:03:00] picture perfect. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so they're in Dr. Sullivan's office, and they decide they're going to tell her about A, because they can't take it anymore. Obviously, Emily is just so upset, and Dr.

[00:03:13] ILISSA DALEY: Sullivan's like, I don't understand. You've never told anyone about this. This bully before and the girls are like, no, we didn't know who it is. Obviously, they don't know who it is. They thought maybe in the beginning it was Ali. Then they realized after she was pronounced dead, it could not possibly be her.

[00:03:31] ILISSA DALEY: And so they had clues. They've never been right. And now they're just like, we can't take it anymore. Kate asked, were you surprised that the girls finally decided to tell someone about A? No,

[00:03:45] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: I think it makes sense to tell the therapist. I've kind of just been waiting for them to say something. Yeah. So I wasn't I'm not too surprised with this, actually.

[00:03:55] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Yeah, okay. Yeah. I thought, actually, I was like, maybe they already kind of [00:04:00] told Dr. Sullivan. Some stuff. When they were in, we

[00:04:02] ILISSA DALEY: didn't see all their sessions. Right, in their personal sessions, but I guess they haven't. So after their session, they wonder if they should have told Dr. Sullivan also about the Jenna thing.

[00:04:12] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah, we're back to this. We're back to the Jenna thing. We're back on Jenna's case. Yeah. And speaking of Jenna, Toby witnesses Jenna and Garrett. Garrett leaving Jason's house and Jenna waiting in the car. She's putting cherry pits on the dashboard. It's very strange. And they kiss and make nicey nice to each other and Toby's like, oh, and I'm like, didn't Toby know this?

[00:04:33] ILISSA DALEY: Like why, why do we have this scene? I guess to show a scene later of Jenna crying on the phone and they're thinking maybe it's her and Garrett got into some sort of fight. She was crying on the phone. She was just like, this is not what we agreed on and the girls are like watching. Oh,

[00:04:47] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: yeah. And also maybe just for Toby to gain more to the whole, oh, Garrett and Jason are working together.

[00:04:54] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Something's not right here.

[00:04:56] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah. Hmm. Back over [00:05:00] to Dr. Sullivan. She was asked by the principal to make a Presentation about bullying and she directs us at mostly cyber bullying. Mm hmm. Yeah, which is very With the times obviously now it's even more so ridiculous But the girls feel kind of pointed out and uneasy and definitely vulnerable when she's talking about Bullies and how you can do it And nobody knows who you are, and that's the more vicious kind of bully.

[00:05:27] ILISSA DALEY: And it's interesting that they show, like, different kids in the audience. Did you pick up on that?

[00:05:33] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Absolutely. Yeah. I thought we were going to see them throughout the episode. We see Lucas, who we haven't seen. In

[00:05:39] ILISSA DALEY: a really long time. What was the point? I wonder if they had a deleted scene or something.

[00:05:44] ILISSA DALEY: Because why bring in, like, Brant and the character of Lucas

[00:05:50] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: just for that? Mona for a hot second. Mona for a hot second. I can understand Mona, like, you

[00:05:53] ILISSA DALEY: know. Right. Mona's more of a prominent character, but like, Noel and Lucas? It was weird. Yeah, it [00:06:00] was weird. And I was like, huh, I wonder if that was on purpose.

[00:06:04] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah. You know. Yeah. Um, so after the assembly, Jenna is passing by the girls, and she makes some snide comment about how Allison would just benefit so much from this presentation, and Emily is like, basically, like, you can't sit with us, she like, pops off, and she's like, Jenna, you're the bully. Can you move your stick?

[00:06:24] ILISSA DALEY: The sass, the sass. Emily is popping. She's popping. She's not the weakest link. And like we know that Jenna has beef with the girls because of a big reason. Yeah. I'm just like, why are we going back to the Jenna of it all, though? Like, I, we should. I guess in my brain, it's like, you want to find out who A is, right?

[00:06:47] ILISSA DALEY: And so it's like, well, Jason's guilty, and Jenna's guilty of this, and this person, and Garrett, and you're like, Where are we, like, is everything tied? Is everything together or is everything not together? It's like, every episode we get like [00:07:00] four different, like, we're supposed to be suspicious of this person.

[00:07:02] ILISSA DALEY: And it's like, it feels unnecessary and a

[00:07:06] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: waste of time. Well, now it's like Jenna's associated with Garrett, who's associated with Jason. Right, right. So That, that triangle is interesting. It is. How are the three of them working together now, this whole, what is it, N. A. T.? The N. A. T.

[00:07:21] ILISSA DALEY: club.

[00:07:21] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: We still don't really

[00:07:22] ILISSA DALEY: know much about that.

[00:07:24] ILISSA DALEY: No, we don't. I hope it comes to fruition. Soon. Soon, hopefully. Um, yeah, so then, Emily and Ashley end up hanging out later on because, um, You know, it's the rehearsal dinner for Tom and Ashley's obviously having a weird time with it, especially because her ex mother in law is in town and Emily has nothing to do for the night, and they kind of discuss relationships and like past love and why things didn't work out and about how things ended with Samara.

[00:07:56] ILISSA DALEY: And so, Emily picks up her phone and it looks like she's [00:08:00] about to call someone so you, the audience thinks that it's Samara. No, the audience thought it was Paige. Well, did you really think it was Paige? Yes! Oh, you're waiting for Paige this whole time. I predicted last week. I know, I know you did, right? No, maybe if your feelings were changed.

[00:08:13] ILISSA DALEY: No, no,

[00:08:14] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: I thought we were calling

[00:08:15] ILISSA DALEY: Paige. Because Ashley says about like, almost like no closure. And how she wished she had closure and now she does, so it's good for her and kind of how wishes Emily would get the same. So immediately in my head, I'm like, well, to me that's Maya. But I could understand, no I didn't, I mean, I knew Maya was coming obviously, but I understood where the writers were going with that.

[00:08:41] ILISSA DALEY: to show next that Maya was coming back, but it could also very well be for Paige because it's a very similar scenario. And she's more recent. And she is

[00:08:49] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: more recent. Maya, to me, you know, went to that weird camp that her parents sent her to. She

[00:08:54] ILISSA DALEY: did, yeah. That's it. True north. True north. Right.

[00:08:58] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Yeah, so to me, [00:09:00] Maya's

[00:09:00] ILISSA DALEY: gone.

[00:09:01] ILISSA DALEY: Kat asks, what does Michelle think of the decision to bring back Maya instead of Paige? Any predictions on the Maya Emily storyline and if Paige does return? Well, I

[00:09:13] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: know Paige returns because you told me Paige returns. Yes, she does. But I don't think Paige is returning any time soon. Is Samara gone? She's on the

[00:09:20] ILISSA DALEY: island.

[00:09:21] ILISSA DALEY: Oh! Are you happy about that? I'm happy about it. I guess. It was too abrupt for you? You didn't, weren't expecting it? There was no break and closure. Well, she was like, Emily, you're a liar. Bye. I guess

[00:09:35] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: so. So her, Quinn, like, the whole group is gone.

[00:09:38] ILISSA DALEY: Gone. Quinn's on the island. And Maya's here for a little while?

[00:09:41] ILISSA DALEY: Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

[00:09:49] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: I feel about it. I guess Maya's back. So Maya's 45 minutes away. Yes. Close ish, as she said. Close ish. Close ish. Yeah. [00:10:00] Okay, so I guess they'll start hanging out

[00:10:01] ILISSA DALEY: a little bit more. Yeah, they're, they're excited to catch up and some, uh, some more. Maya was happy to hear that Pam has kind of let up a little bit about Emily and who she is.

[00:10:12] ILISSA DALEY: And she looks forward to seeing that, you know, Uh, follow through and it looks like they're gonna, you know, see each other again. I mean, we like Maya. We do, yeah. I'm happy for Emily. Emily's like a little skitty schoolgirl when she's near

[00:10:24] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Maya. Yeah, it's really cute to watch those two together.

[00:10:27] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah. And Maya's just like so, like, grounded in herself.

[00:10:32] ILISSA DALEY: She's just like, she knows herself. At such a young age, she's like, no, I am who I am. Truly

[00:10:36] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: confident. However, I guess we're no longer allergic to seafood, as you pointed out, because she ordered the calamari.

[00:10:44] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah, a lot of people wrote in about that, and then on the wiki page they wrote like a blooper, kind of like, huh, isn't Maya supposed to be allergic to shellfish?

[00:10:53] ILISSA DALEY: Unless she was just telling Pam, like, I don't want your food. It's calamari. Shellfish. Shellfish. Do we want to look it up? [00:11:00] Shellfish. Seafood

[00:11:00] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: without a backbone. Include crustaceans such as prawn, shrimp, lobster, crab, crayfish, and ya Yabies? Y A B B I E S? Don't know that. Oysters, mussels, clams, octopus, squid, calamari, sea slugs, eels.

[00:11:15] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: You're right. I'm sorry. I didn't I really didn't know. It's

[00:11:18] ILISSA DALEY: alright. You don't eat it. Shellfish. Seafood without a backbone. I guess that's, I guess it's just not necessarily just without a shell, with a shell. Obsters don't have backbones. Guess not. All right, so during this time when everything is happening, Dr.

[00:11:36] ILISSA DALEY: Sullivan gets a phone call from an unknown number and it's a private session between her and the girls and something she said. playing over and over again. She hangs up the it's playing over and over again on a loop. She's so freaked out. And so she calls the police. One of these officers, of course, being fucking Garrett.

[00:11:56] ILISSA DALEY: And they assume that this person might be the one that broke into her office a [00:12:00] few weeks back. And they want to go through her case files to see if they can Come up with something. And she's like, no, I can't give that to you. It's patient confidentiality against HIPAA. And how about go do a search? And they, it's like, they clearly didn't look anywhere in the office.

[00:12:15] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Yeah. Garrett was just like, well, tell us the names. And I feel like Garrett knows. He knows who it was. Can we just talk about what was on repeat? I'm the first person you've told about this. I don't really even understand that sentence. And I'm the first person you've told about this. And

[00:12:36] ILISSA DALEY: I'm the first.

[00:12:37] ILISSA DALEY: Well, I mean, that's, that's, obviously, we know she said that to the girls. And now that's the part that they focus on is that she's the first and only person that knows. So it was her voice. Oh, yeah. It was, it was the session we see with her and the girls.

[00:12:52] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: I don't know why when I heard that it didn't sound like her.

[00:12:56] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: It sounded more like robotic. Yeah. That's what threw [00:13:00] me. Sorry. A

[00:13:00] ILISSA DALEY: I. A I. I love it. Exactly. Yes. Yeah. So it was her voice on a loop. Got it. From the session earlier. Yeah. And she's freaked out and the cops don't find anything. And they keep telling her like, oh, the sound system must be in the hall or in the, you know, whatever.

[00:13:17] ILISSA DALEY: And they're bullshitting her thinking she's crazy. And so she goes through her office and she's going through her files and she's like, Like a little detective and she's looking through the girl's files and then she's also looking at other patients of hers just in case something comes through. And there's this one part about saying nosy bitches in someone's file and then nosy bitches was actually what was spray painted in her office.

[00:13:41] ILISSA DALEY: So now she's like, wait a minute, I know who this person must be because these two things match up. Yeah,

[00:13:48] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: so the nosy bitches that she saw in her notes was not from one of the girls.

[00:13:53] ILISSA DALEY: No, it was from some other file. Someone had been in a session. One of her other clients. Right, one of her other clients had mentioned something [00:14:00] about nosy bitches and now it's just coming to her, just coming to light for her that that was actually what was spray painted on her office wall.

[00:14:08] ILISSA DALEY: So she's like, wait a minute, this seems to track, I think I know who A is. Like I have, I know who A is. And so while Emily is at dinner with Maya, Dr. Sullivan calls her and she's like, Please get everyone rounded up. You need to meet me in the office because I know who A is. And of course, Emily's like, Yeah, sure.

[00:14:26] ILISSA DALEY: We don't say who A is on the phone. We make things a lot easier, but she doesn't say who it is. And so when the girls all get to the office, Dr. Sullivan's not there. And then they get a text from A stating that the doctor is out. This like,

[00:14:43] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: hurts my heart. I'm like, did you slash her tires? Did you literally murder her?

[00:14:49] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: I don't think we murdered her. That would be

[00:14:51] ILISSA DALEY: really intense. The show does some intense things sometimes. And be really messed up. Yeah. Well, the last scene is this [00:15:00] black gloved person removing this little microphone from a Freud, I think, bobble head. Yeah. So obviously the cops didn't look very hard for that.

[00:15:10] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Yeah, and also taking the

[00:15:11] ILISSA DALEY: files, the notes. And they took either theirs or the girl's or all of them and peaced out. Like, if

[00:15:20] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: they did something to interfere with Dr. Sullivan, like, slash the tires, she couldn't make it to the, to the girls, even though I thought she made that

[00:15:26] ILISSA DALEY: call from the office. From the office.

[00:15:28] ILISSA DALEY: Mm

[00:15:28] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: hmm. Whatever. Maybe gets a weird call. And then when she goes back to her notes to cross reference and be like, Oh my god, they took my file. She would still remember the

[00:15:36] ILISSA DALEY: name. Right, but A doesn't, is not going to allow Dr. Sullivan to tell the girls.

[00:15:46] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: You're not gonna confront, she's not on the island?

[00:15:49] ILISSA DALEY: She's not.

[00:15:52] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Maybe she got threatened and she's like, I'm sorry girls, I had to peace out. I can't deal with this.

[00:15:58] ILISSA DALEY: My life is threatened. I mean, I [00:16:00] wouldn't. Right? A, like, already has threatened her. And we do see outside of her window is a black hooded figure, so we clearly know. Nosy bitches. She's up to. Okay.

[00:16:13] ILISSA DALEY: Like that, that,

[00:16:16] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: sorry. I know you wanna move on, but like, no, it just, it makes me think it's a petty girl. No boy is sitting in there and be like, nosy bitches. Nosy bitches. . I mean, maybe, but I don't, I don't know. I just don't see them musing that term, but, okay. Move on.

[00:16:33] ILISSA DALEY: I will move on, but I, we, I'm sure you can predict much Yeah.

[00:16:37] ILISSA DALEY: Later. Yeah. Yeah. All right. So over to Spencer. Who, um. It seems after Garrett and Jenna had left Jason's they, like I said, they got into a little bit of a fight and Spencer is worried about her and Toby's relationship because when Jenna's on the warpath anything can happen and Toby's like, look, we're good, we're so good.

[00:16:55] ILISSA DALEY: And it's so cute. My heart was a little swoony. [00:17:00] We love Toby. We love

[00:17:02] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Toby. We're good. Yes, Toby. Yeah, you're so

[00:17:07] ILISSA DALEY: confident. I love it. We good boo. Yeah. Yeah. And so we have this big scene where Toby and Spencer are like making out in the truck in front of her house, which is actually also in front of the De Laurentiis house.

[00:17:17] ILISSA DALEY: I don't know why we had to do this. It's very out in the open. It's weird. Um, and Toby thinks he sees someone up in Jason's house, and then Spencer sees that there's two shadows, and she's freaking out, and she's like, You know what? I'm sick of this shit, and I'm gonna march up there, I'm gonna see who's spying on us, and then out walks her father, and she's like, whoa, whoa, whoa.

[00:17:38] ILISSA DALEY: What is happening here? Why were you inside? And he's like, forget it. And Toby's like, no, you need to tell her the truth. Like enough is enough. And he's like, you want a job? I can get you kicked out of this job real quick. And Toby's not backing down. It's so sexy. It's so perfect. We love it. It's so, so good.

[00:17:56] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah. And Peter gets really, really [00:18:00] angry. Yeah. He ends up following the truck and punching the truck, uh, door while Spencer gets in there. It's just, it's not a good look for him. And so Spencer is obviously not going to let this go. She gets home later on and he's actually willing to talk to her finally.

[00:18:14] ILISSA DALEY: And so he tells her, look, I have a secret. Yeah. Uh, I. I've changed the grandmother of the De Laurentiis will to say that her, you know, her assets will go to both grandchildren, however, that's not the original plan. A week before Allison went missing, it was only written that Allison would get the stuff in the will and Jason was written out of the will and then Allison went missing and the parents were like, we need to get Jason back on this well so that he doesn't look suspicious.

[00:18:48] ILISSA DALEY: And Spencer's like, Jason, Jason, Jason did it. We need to go to the police right now! And she has a flashback of when Grandma Regina [00:19:00] randomly isn't down again on his grandmother. Let's use the actress, you know? Right? Let's just use her. Yeah. And so, Allison had asked her about her children and what would it take for her to write her children out of her will.

[00:19:13] ILISSA DALEY: Would something like a person selling a family heirloom for drug money do it? And they don't really go into it, but Spencer remembers that. Which I'm like, okay, so Jason was gonna sell a family heirloom, whatever this may be, to get money for his drugs and his addiction, and Allie didn't like that. Right.

[00:19:34] ILISSA DALEY: So, I guess that, like, a cat had asked us, what do we think the reason Allie had the grandmother change the will was? Like, it can't, but can it only be that they were trying to sell this family heirloom?

[00:19:47] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: No, I think maybe that adds to it. I think Jason was just doing bad stuff. Like, we can't trust him. I have to say, Jason needs to stop [00:20:00] talking and doing things by his window.

[00:20:02] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Like, I'm assuming the house is probably pretty deep,

[00:20:05] ILISSA DALEY: right? You

[00:20:06] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: can probably go in another room and have a conversation. Why are we always by the window to create a silhouette? And why was Peter on the top floor by the window? Wouldn't you have that kind of conversation in your kitchen? Right. Whatever they were

[00:20:20] ILISSA DALEY: talking about.

[00:20:20] ILISSA DALEY: Well Whose room is that, you think? Yeah, I think it's Allie's old bedroom. Yeah, it's weird. Yeah, it's weird. It is weird. I was joking with Michelle. I was like, Michelle, they're lovers and she was like, what? And I was like, wouldn't that be amazing though? Yeah, I mean, I would

[00:20:37] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: love if Jason and Peter were

[00:20:39] ILISSA DALEY: lovers.

[00:20:39] ILISSA DALEY: So good. All right, so overdraw. Aria's storyline, we have Ella and Byron again, unfortunately, having to deal with Mike and his so called, we'll say depression, because it's not 100 percent his diagnosis, but it seems like that's where they're leaning is that he has teen [00:21:00] depression. Teen depression. Teen depression, which is like, um, I did, I did reach out to our family therapist, Samantha Rubenstein, um.

[00:21:10] ILISSA DALEY: And she did give me some insight because Kate had asked, what is our thoughts on medication verse not, you know, talk therapy? Um, obviously Ella doesn't want Mike to be on any medication. She feels like at least that's not the first step. She wants him to just keep, continue to talk. And Byron's like, hey, look.

[00:21:30] ILISSA DALEY: Listen to like my family history. Maybe this medication is the first step. That's right for Mike. So I was like that obviously I'm not a clinician and so I didn't want to say anything that was going to be used against me. Oh, sure. I mean, we're not

[00:21:48] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: experts. It's out of our scope. Like, and I know it's on, it's a

[00:21:52] ILISSA DALEY: TV show.

[00:21:53] ILISSA DALEY: It's right. And I know Kate's not asking this to like, you know, singly point us out about it. I mean, it's a good question. It's a great [00:22:00] question.

[00:22:00] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: I, I don't, I think every case is different. What, what did Samuel, uh,

[00:22:06] ILISSA DALEY: Rubenstein say? I always say medication, right? Well, if they're like swimmers, they keep you afloat, but they don't teach you how to swim.

[00:22:16] ILISSA DALEY: So if he's on medication and he's feeling better, but he's not doing anything different in his life to enhance his life, to improve outcomes, to build his self esteem and awareness as to why he's doing what he's doing, medication is only going to get him so far. So, the long and the short of it is, depends on if it's biological or environmental.

[00:22:37] ILISSA DALEY: Medication helps, but it helps to an extent. But same thing goes for therapy. Sometimes people are doing all the things. They're getting into a routine. They're journaling. They're challenging and identifying their negative automatic thoughts. We're replacing them with healthier thoughts. We're doing self positive talk.

[00:22:53] ILISSA DALEY: We're journaling. We're doing mindfulness based stuff. And it absolutely makes a difference. [00:23:00] But sometimes people need medication, too, to move that needle that much more forward, back toward their baseline. So in its purest form, it's People feel like I want to feel better before I do different. And it's you have to do different to feel better.

[00:23:16] ILISSA DALEY: Hmm. Right. So, and, and, and to sum it up, she basically said, It depends on the person, obviously, but generally, if you were to do medication, you still need that talk therapy because potentially people could have anger or behavioral issues, which is very clear with Mike. definitely having some sort of behavioral anger or frustration, and so the medication can subdue some of those feelings, but the therapy is to get to like the root of having like those other symptoms.

[00:23:57] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah, makes sense. So, I mean, I think [00:24:00] I would still initially feel like my child should have talk therapy even though he's gonna probably Not want to do such a thing. And that therapist might be

[00:24:09] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: like, hey I think it'd be great if you looked into a psychiatrist and go the medical route You know, meta

[00:24:16] ILISSA DALEY: medication route.

[00:24:17] ILISSA DALEY: Right. So, and Byron obviously wants them to, to counsel with the psycho psychologist so that he can get the medication, but Ella obviously doesn't really want that to happen just yet, so they're not really on the same page. And so, Mike has an episode where, it's very strange, and I'm trying to think if we go back to this, he looks like he's got like an internet buddy.

[00:24:39] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah, and Arya's like, what are you doing in here? Mom wants help with dinner. And he's like, get out. You weren't invited. Like, I'm busy. I'm busy. And Ella comes in. She's like, what are you doing? He's like, I'm busy. Like, everyone get out of here. I'm like, I'm doing something. And so Ella takes the computer and when he gets it back, he like, angrily tries to rip it out of her hands and it shoves her across the room and she [00:25:00] ends up like, spraining her wrist and she doesn't tell Byron what the reason is and she tells Arya, do not tell him.

[00:25:06] ILISSA DALEY: Which I was like, this is Bad. Really bad. That's bad. Obviously your child is going through something and he's having behavioral issues and you're not going to tell the father.

[00:25:16] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: And you're telling your other kid, oh, you gotta keep this a secret.

[00:25:21] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah, that's not good. That's really bad. That's really bad.

[00:25:24] ILISSA DALEY: That's like, you shouldn't. No. I wasn't about that. No. Um, so then later on, Aria sees Mike and he's really upset in his room and he's crying and he's like, I hope mom's okay. Like, I do feel really bad. And she's like, it's gonna be fine. And he's like, am I gonna be fine though? Like, he just doesn't. He can't grasp what's happening to him, and he doesn't know how to help himself.

[00:25:44] ILISSA DALEY: So hopefully, he does eventually get the help he needs, and so she like comforts him, and he cries in her arms, and it's very sweet and sad. And so then Aria goes downstairs, and she tells her parents like, Look, we have some secrets here. And Vic was like, did you think she was going to [00:26:00] say that her and Ezra were together because she did?

[00:26:04] ILISSA DALEY: I was like, I don't know. I can see where you're going with that. Yeah. She's like, I have to, I have to get secrets out. So she ends up telling her parents that this was not an isolated incident. Mike has broken into many houses in the past and what are they going to do about it? And then Mike comes down and we don't see what happens, but we're hopeful that he's gonna talk to at least his family and try and sort some things out.

[00:26:26] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Yeah, it looked like it was gonna go to a good place.

[00:26:28] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah. Um, Britt asks, do you think all this turmoil will make Aria hold off on telling her parents about Ezra? Yes. Yeah, I'd say so. Absolutely. I'd say so. Especially

[00:26:39] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: since Ella was not too keen on the idea of Spencer and Ezra getting together. I actually thought that that.

[00:26:46] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Image was gonna come through. Mm-Hmm. . And it was kind of be this, uh, exchange of, hey, and it maybe it could still happen. Like, mom, I'll keep your secret from Dad if you Oh. Accept my

[00:26:58] ILISSA DALEY: relationship. [00:27:00] I mean, that's a good thought. Do you think that she would tell both parents together or maybe she would confine an Ella first about her

[00:27:09] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: and Ezra Affair?

[00:27:11] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: You mean her and Ezra? Yeah. Yeah. I think, well, I think Ella would get the text. And it would be a secret between her and Ella. I think Byron was also gonna go back to his little thing on the side. Oh, Meredith. Yeah. Meredith. I think it's, yeah, I don't think these two

[00:27:29] ILISSA DALEY: are Endgame. No. Or second endgame or whatever.

[00:27:32] ILISSA DALEY: Whatever it is. Mm mm. Mm mm. There you go. Alright, so lastly we have to talk about Hannah and Tom's rehearsal dinner, which is a nightmare. And so Hannah's trying to get on Kate's good side She asked Spencer to bring her some horse books, which was very random But she said it was better than a calendar and Spencer's like well It'd be better if you bought them from new like these are my old Used books.

[00:27:54] ILISSA DALEY: So weird, but okay as we said Hannah's grandma Tom's mom [00:28:00] Regina is in town because of the rehearsal dinner and that evening She wants Ashley, she's, she's speaking to Ashley and Hannah and wants them to kind of, like, get Tom to reconsider this wedding and wants Ashley to take Tom back and she wants Hannah to, like, stir up some shit because she doesn't want Tom marrying Isabel.

[00:28:22] ILISSA DALEY: She doesn't like her.

[00:28:24] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: It's really weird that Regina flew in from Cincinnati, but she's from Oklahoma. Yeah. But she flies, she goes to their place instead of her son's.

[00:28:34] ILISSA DALEY: Yes. Very strange. Because I guess she's just closer with them. I guess. And maybe she just really, truly does not like Isabel. I mean, it seems that way.

[00:28:43] ILISSA DALEY: It seems that way. It seems like it's a short amount of time, like they really, maybe, or maybe not. Because I feel like he cheated with Isabel on Ashley, right? And that must have been a few years ago at this point. I also feel like really like her son. [00:29:00] No. It doesn't seem like she likes him either. No. She loves Ashley and she loves Hannah.

[00:29:03] ILISSA DALEY: Seems the other brother is the favorite. That's right. That's right. I forgot what his name was. Steve or something. Um, so Tom at the last minute of course tells Hannah that him and Kate have to write a speech which I'm like, fuck you dad. Yeah, that's awful. That's so mean to do to a high schooler. And so, Hannah has to come up with this with Kate at the rehearsal dinner, and so she apologizes to Kate, she gives her the books, Kate seems like she accepts the apology, she apologizes to Hannah, but I did tease last week that she makes shit happen for Hannah, so she pulls out of her pocketbook a water bottle, and in it is vodka, and she's like, hey, let's get, like, lit.

[00:29:44] ILISSA DALEY: Liquid courage. Liquid courage, right before our speech, we'll be fine, just a little bit. And, uh, well, she gives Hannah a lot. She gives her a lot. And to herself, she only gives water. I don't know how she accomplished this, but she did. Mm hmm. And Hannah is really [00:30:00] getting drunk. And then Kate's like, I have dress duty.

[00:30:02] ILISSA DALEY: You want to come see it? Where, I don't know where the hell this rehearsal dinner is, but why would you randomly have the dress in the middle of the party? So weird. And they bring it into the bathroom, which is like a huge bathroom. And in it, Kate opens the dress and she holds the dress up and she's like, Hannah, you should try it on.

[00:30:18] ILISSA DALEY: It would look amazing with your skin tone. And Hannah's like, it would look amazing. And then Kate leaves and Hannah's like, really starting to feel nauseous and she's playing with the dress and she ends up vomiting all over Isabel's wedding dress. But like, how did

[00:30:33] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Kate know she would vom?

[00:30:34] ILISSA DALEY: I guess, like, how did she know?

[00:30:36] ILISSA DALEY: She would just get her drunk enough at least not to be able to make the speech or embarrass them. Like, she probably didn't even know. She was like, oh, let me just keep thinking of things Hannah could fuck up. Right.

[00:30:43] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Let me leave her with the dress. Let me like, I mean, everything's coming up. Kate,

[00:30:48] ILISSA DALEY: it seems everything.

[00:30:49] ILISSA DALEY: Yes. Kate was able to be sober enough to have this speech and Tom comes in the bathroom and he's like, Kate said, you were sick, obviously or not. You're just really drunk and you've ruined Isabel's [00:31:00] dress. And then Regina, Hannah's grandmother comes in. She's like, let me take care of this. So she doesn't like Hannah's trying to tell Tom, look.

[00:31:07] ILISSA DALEY: Isabel and I both, Isabel, Kate and I both got really drunk and he's like, no, Kate's not drunk. You're the one who's drunk and you're making a spectacle and I'm really pissed. And Regina like gets on to Kate. She's like, um, I'm sorry, there's only water in your water bottle. And I see what you did here.

[00:31:25] ILISSA DALEY: Regina's queen bee. And Han is like, I got your number. Yeah. I got it. Yeah. Regina is queen bee. I

[00:31:31] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: love Regina. I hope she's not on the island.

[00:31:32] ILISSA DALEY: No, she's not. She's not. She's not. Okay. Okay. I just had a thought. Okay. Um, listeners want to know, will Hannah tell her parents the truth about what Kate did to her?

[00:31:44] ILISSA DALEY: No. Never? Ever? I mean, once,

[00:31:47] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: she's just gonna get her own revenge. Like, I

[00:31:51] ILISSA DALEY: don't think, mm mm. What do you think her revenge could be? I think

[00:31:56] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: it's gonna be a lot of like, tip for tap, back and forth, messing with [00:32:00] her. I don't, I don't think she's gonna tell. Cause Regina knows. Like, and Tom, no, I don't think she's going to involve them.

[00:32:10] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: It feels, and I kept saying this, it feels very Gossip Girl. It does. And it feels very disconnected from the A

[00:32:15] ILISSA DALEY: of it all. It does. Yes. Because this is her own personal life. Right. And

[00:32:19] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: like you said, Kate really, this storyline does get old for you. You, after a while, you're like not into it. Yeah.

[00:32:24] ILISSA DALEY: So. I remember that.

[00:32:27] ILISSA DALEY: I mean,

[00:32:27] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: maybe she'll tell Ashley, like, yeah, I'm like not a fan and she's really annoying. She's not going to tell.

[00:32:34] ILISSA DALEY: Mm mm. Well, we'll take a short break and then we'll be back to answer. Some more questions. And do the ice cream!

[00:32:48] ILISSA DALEY: Okay, some lucky Leon's ladle. Ben and Jerry's cookies and cream cheesecake core is the episode ice cream. Wow. Thank you, Michael. That's a lot going on [00:33:00] there. That's a lot going on. Chocolate and cheesecake ice cream. So chocolate cookies and a cheesecake core. Like the cookie pieces scattered throughout the ice cream, the lives of the liars are being broken up into pieces.

[00:33:12] ILISSA DALEY: First we have Mike's new mood causing him to lash out at Ella and hurting her, giving Aria another secret to keep to hold over her family. To hold her family together, but as we see throughout the episode, it slowly chips away at her until she refuses to hurt the family again by keeping another secret.

[00:33:30] ILISSA DALEY: Emily's love life with Oliver is still not put back together, but are we that upset over it? No, because a piece of Emily's past came back into her life, we are here for it. Speaking of pieces of the past coming back, Spencer has a flashback of a question Allie asked about what a grandchild would have to do to get disinherited, giving Spencer another piece to who killed Allie puzzle that she is so keen on solving and blaming Jason for.

[00:33:57] ILISSA DALEY: While it looks like the Jason might be to blame for Allie's [00:34:00] murder, the murdering of Kate's wedding dress, however, is not Hannah's fault. The stunt Kate pulled had caused a crack to reappear in the already fragile and newly repaired relationship with Hannah and her dad. Will Hannah and Tom be able to move past this and put the pieces of their relationship back together?

[00:34:20] ILISSA DALEY: Only time will tell. One piece of The Liar's Lives they'd love to see break away forever is the A part and they were so close as Dr. Sullivan put the pieces together. A and figured out who A is. However, A got involved and made sure that piece of information would never get out. Lastly, the liquid cheesecake core of this ice cream is also represented in Hannah by her choice of liquid diet in this episode.

[00:34:44] ILISSA DALEY: Mike, he just recapped

[00:34:46] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: the whole episode!

[00:34:47] ILISSA DALEY: We should have just read that and said goodnight! You want to kill me. You seriously want to kill me. I think he wants to make it longer and longer each time so that I pass out. That was like an essay. I mean, it's beautifully [00:35:00] written, but like, wow. He should just

[00:35:03] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: write our recaps.

[00:35:05] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: What are we doing?

[00:35:06] ILISSA DALEY: Why are we here? What are we doing? Should I use that for the summaries instead of the IMDb? Whew. Wow. Oh my gosh, I actually had a breath. Wow. I didn't write down MVP or shittiest, but I can come up with one. Yeah, I have an MVP. Ready? Yeah, three, two, one, Regina.

[00:35:26] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: I love her. I am

[00:35:28] ILISSA DALEY: Regina George.

[00:35:29] ILISSA DALEY: I'm a massive deal. Or whatever it is, big deal, massive deal. No, massive deal.

[00:35:35] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Uh, yeah, Regina was great. I loved her one liners. What was it? Right? Wipe my dew from

[00:35:42] ILISSA DALEY: my lily.

[00:35:46] ILISSA DALEY: And then she also says, A cow's happy, but they also made sloppy jokes or something ridiculous, and I was like, oh my god. She's great. She is like Hannah Southern and loose. [00:36:00] Yeah. That

[00:36:00] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: accent, I really thought she was from the South, but she's from the Midwest, it turns

[00:36:03] ILISSA DALEY: out. Yeah. I don't know why they did that, but okay.

[00:36:08] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah. She was great. We loved her. Yeah. Shittiest? I mean, I guess it could be a toss up. It's Kate. It's Kate. But Spencer kind of annoyed me. Spencer was so annoying. And then there's Garrett, who's like the always nasty turd. And then there's Jenna. Not really. There's Peter. Peter was douchey. He did finally, finally, kindly, finally reveal a secret.

[00:36:35] ILISSA DALEY: And Michelle was like, I'm on the edge of my seat. Baiting breath. And I'm like, And then I was like, no more secrets tonight, Michelle. That's all I can tell for the evening. I was like, damn you, Pierre! Yeah, Spencer's like, what else? What does Ali's family have on you? He's like, that's enough for tonight. I can't say any more.

[00:36:51] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah. Frustration. I would give this like a two. Yeah, it wasn't really cringey. When I watch this by myself, I like almost [00:37:00] spit take when Emily's like, Can you move your stick? I was like, No! That was terrible! But other than that, I thought the episode was extremely enjoyable.

[00:37:13] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: I agree. Yeah, it wasn't cringey.

[00:37:15] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: A two's good. Yeah. A two's good. A two's

[00:37:17] ILISSA DALEY: good. Two for the stick. Just that one we'll see. Yeah. All right. I'm going to give you the title for episode 12. We are live next week, so if you are a patron of the Upper East Siders tier, please join us. We'll be live 8 p. m. EST over on Patreon with the link. And it's a fun time.

[00:37:35] ILISSA DALEY: This is like definitely an episode you'd like to watch live with us. We do Discord at 7. Live at 8. I'm so fun.

[00:37:42] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: I'm so fun. I'm so fun. I am fun You are but I love when a good episode is when we're doing it.

[00:37:50] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah, same. I was like opposite Oh, this really worked out. Yeah, great. Well for us. That's great. That's great.

[00:37:55] ILISSA DALEY: So the title is over my dead body[00:38:00]

[00:38:05] ILISSA DALEY: And my secret I had so many things I could give you but basically to sum it all up All of our liars give in to A, someway, somehow, with their individual storylines, because they have to save Dr. Sullivan. Oh my god! Yeah, that's like the whole story, at least. There's so many like little things, I'm like, I can't give you those yet.

[00:38:29] ILISSA DALEY: So she's in trouble. She's in trouble. Oh my

[00:38:31] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: god, she's probably locked in a bunker. She's locked in a bunker, she's being tortured, and the only way to rescue her is they're gonna have to do their individual That's going to include

[00:38:45] ILISSA DALEY: Ellen knowing. Yeah, what's it, okay. It's

[00:38:47] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: going to include Ellen knowing.

[00:38:48] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Mhm. I don't really know with Hannah unless we're going to tie Kate into this A stuff. I don't, and also wouldn't the wedding be next

[00:38:58] ILISSA DALEY: week? The wedding is next week. It [00:39:00] is next week. Okay.

[00:39:01] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: It is Wex Week. It's Wex Week? It's Wex Week? You literally can see the decline y'all. You literally

[00:39:09] ILISSA DALEY: can see it. After we take a break it's like bleh, bleh.

[00:39:12] ILISSA DALEY: Yeah, it's like 9. 30. Woo. Yeah, it's late. Uh,

[00:39:17] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: yeah, so maybe she'll have to do something embarrassing at the wedding to prove

[00:39:22] ILISSA DALEY: to A. Okay, so that's Hannah's, Aria's is the Ezra stuff. Yeah. Emily? Uh,

[00:39:31] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: I don't, I don't really know with Emily, I guess, I guess something with Maya.

[00:39:36] ILISSA DALEY: And then Spencer. Spencer is so rough.

[00:39:42] ILISSA DALEY: Spencer's is probably the biggest one that she has to do and it's, Oh my god,

[00:39:45] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: probably defend her father in one way or another. Or, or do something against your father, or destroy something, or like, stop questioning, or I think he's like, fathered [00:40:00] someone. I think, I think Peter

[00:40:03] ILISSA DALEY: He's fathered someone. He's fathered a De Laurentiis.

[00:40:06] ILISSA DALEY: So either Allison or Jason is his child. Mm hmm. That's it. And he obviously wouldn't want to see them harmed. Sure. That's why he was like, it's complicated. Right. Or had an affair,

[00:40:20] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: or had an affair with

[00:40:22] ILISSA DALEY: the mom. With Jessica. Jessica. Yeah.

[00:40:26] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Yeah.

[00:40:26] ILISSA DALEY: Ooh, I am excited. What are your Dr. Sullivan predictions? Like, obviously I know I think she's in a

[00:40:31] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: bunker.

[00:40:32] ILISSA DALEY: But do you think she figured out the real A? Or was that just kind of like a red herring to throw us off?

[00:40:39] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Too close for comfort? Like, I think And A didn't like that? Hmm, I think A is, I think A is a petty little

[00:40:51] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: And But I don't think this is actually, uh, I don't know, I don't, yeah, [00:41:00] I, yeah, yeah. I keep saying yeah, because I know what I'm saying, but like, you listening, it's like, I don't really know what you're saying, Michelle, you just keep

[00:41:06] ILISSA DALEY: saying yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Alright, and that is all we got for tonight.

[00:41:10] ILISSA DALEY: Thank you to everyone for listening. If you are liking the show, you know what to do. Everything is in the description for the episode. If you need to find us on the social or find our Patreon, any of those things. are in the description. So we will be next. We will be next week. We will be back next week for a live podcast with our patrons.

[00:41:30] ILISSA DALEY: Very excited for the episode, which is called Over My Dead Body. It's got to be something crazy, guys. So stoked. Yes, me too.

[00:41:40] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: Thank you so much for listening to We Are Liars, a Pretty Little Liars podcast. You can email us at weareliarspod at gmail. com.

[00:41:47] ILISSA DALEY: If you'd like to leave us a voice message or just say hi, we have a voicemail, 631 600 3916.

[00:41:55] ILISSA DALEY: If you haven't already and you're loving the show, please consider giving us a rating [00:42:00] and review. This has been

[00:42:01] MICHELLE RUBINSTEIN: a Total Betty Podcast. Produced and edited by Michelle Rubinstein and Ilissa Daley. Music by Anthony Viccora.

[00:42:10] ​