We Are Liars - A Pretty Little Liars Podcast

Pretty Little Liars Podcast | We Are Liars Season 2 Episode 16 - Let The Water Hold Me Down
Michelle Rubinstein: [00:00:00] It's funny when we were watching and we're having the Lucas scene, Lucas, Caleb, and Hannah, and he just came in from the rain. I wasn't really focusing. So I was like, I'm a little distracted. Like Caleb looks so good. It's a little moistened. He's got that green jacket on. His hair's a little wet. I was like, I have
Ilissa Daley: to say Lucas looks pretty nice wet too.
We're Liars podcast. Welcome back. Woohoo. Yay. We're here for episode 16 of season two. Let the Water Hold Me Down, aired January 16th, 2012, written by Brian M. Holden and directed by Chris Grismer. With Lucas missing and questions surrounding what happened out on the [00:01:00] lake, Hannah could barely catch her breath.
Spencer follows a lead about A, which guides her to an unexpected place and revelation. Revelations! So Before we get into the summary, I wanted to shout out a special email that we got from Stephanie H, who said that they swore for years they'd never watch the show, making them a liar like us as well, which I thought was so great.
Welcome. And they are doing a whole journey of Teen dramas. So I'm like, I hope you catch some of our other little babes out there. So thank you so much for listening. We love getting emails. Again, if you are interested in sending us an email, we are liarspod at gmail. com. It's always in the link for the episode.
Just reach out and tell us when you start listening, what you like, what. You know keeps you here. We love that stuff. So this is the network
Michelle Rubinstein: for you
Ilissa Daley: Hell, yeah, all the teen dramas all the teen dramas. I love it. Thank you So [00:02:00] in this episode the aftermath of Hannah feeling very betrayed and scared of Lucas I even plays this cruel joke where they fill her water bottle with dirty lake water She's gonna go take a sip and the girls are like wait, wait, wait now
Michelle Rubinstein: convenient How did they know she
Ilissa Daley: would take a step right?
Well, that's what the girls were saying. They're like nobody Hadn't his water bottles in the car like we don't understand how they possibly could get And not even that
Michelle Rubinstein: like fine like maybe At some point she would take a sip but like right as she takes a sip they get the text, right? It's too convenient this episode everything is lining up perfectly with a and I
Ilissa Daley: yep agreed.
I guess it's the power of a right? It's the power of a She tells the girls that Lucas destroyed Allie's memorial. So this is the first time that they're hearing about it. Yeah. Realizing that Lucas does have a little bit more of a dark side than they anticipated. And Ashley feels terrible because she feels responsible being that Lucas left.[00:03:00]
Hannah's party and he's nowhere to be found but then apparently He had called his parents. So he like we know he's alive and well, but he just doesn't want to come home So hannah's not really too concerned about it. She's like afraid at any moment. He's gonna like find her Yeah, wouldn't you? Yes. She has she's on edge.
She's having like a lot of ptsd Hannah, she is at school with Mona and Mona's trying to tell her about her Noel issues about how Noel's pulling away and last episode She wanted to do like a skinny dip situation to kind of keep him and Hannah's really trying to listen, but she can't She can't focus.
And then all she can focus on is this picture of her from homecoming that they're taking down because of the reputation situation. And Mona's like, you can't, she's, she'll not take down her, her, uh, the reign of being queen. Like there's no way that she will not be queen. And At this point, [00:04:00] Mona's like, did you listen to what I was saying though?
And Hannah's like, uh, she's like, you're not, uh, you're not being a good friend. You're being very selfish. Like you're always wrapped up in yourself. And so Hannah, she runs out, she goes into the bathroom, she starts crying in the stall. She's in there for a while. Yeah. Or what it seems like doesn't come out and allows a, or a teammate of a's to like fill up every single sink in the girl's bathroom and to the where let
Michelle Rubinstein: it over fall to the point where it floods and then she sees this wooden boat.
Ilissa Daley: life is but a dream. Again,
Michelle Rubinstein: how did you know Hannah was going to go into the school bathroom? How
Ilissa Daley: did you know Hannah wasn't going to walk out of the bathroom? I guess if they walked out of the bathroom, if she walked out of the bathroom, then it wouldn't be so weird to see another person in there. Maybe they were like, oh, okay.
Fine,
Michelle Rubinstein: but you're carrying around this wooden tiny boat.
Ilissa Daley: Right. It's very
Michelle Rubinstein: What was the plan? If she didn't go into the school bathroom, you could do this at
Ilissa Daley: home? Mm hmm. [00:05:00] Kate asked, did Mona actually like Noel, or was he just a major get? That she felt left down by him breaking it off with her. I think
Michelle Rubinstein: a total major get.
And, but like, hook, line, sinker. So glad we got it.
Ilissa Daley: Yeah. She's like,
Michelle Rubinstein: wow, go me. Go me. And, you know, cause she says along the lines of like, do you know what it's like for me to get a guy like Noel Kahn? I know. I don't know, like, he seemed really into
Ilissa Daley: her last episode. He did. We don't know what happened. She's better off.
She is. Caleb catches on that Hannah's having a really hard time and she's keeping her distance from even really talking about Lucas. And so Caleb's like, he says he's at his cousin's, but I don't believe that. When I called his cousin, his cousin, you know, seemed like he was covering for him and I really want to go find him.
Maybe he went back to Spencer's lake house. You should come with me. I'll go find him. And she's like, maybe not. Maybe we shouldn't do this. And he's [00:06:00] like, you don't actually want to find him. It seems like what happened. And she's like, I told you. And he's like, you didn't tell me the whole thing because clearly something happened here.
Poor Caleb. He's been
Michelle Rubinstein: asking for days of like, What's going on with you and your friends? What happened in the boat? like you're not telling me the full
Ilissa Daley: story here and he feels really badly because Lucas is obviously struggling with something and he feels like he can't tell anyone and Kalo should be there for him He's basically his best friend.
Oh, yeah. He's like, I just want to help him It's really really nice and he's living with
Michelle Rubinstein: Lucas. So It's like brother, bestie.
Ilissa Daley: He says, I feel weird living there without him. Yeah, yeah. Like it's so strange, the dynamic that's going on at home. Okay, so this causes a riff and Luke, uh, Caleb goes to head to find Lucas.
And Hannah's freaked out still. She's at home. It seems because Emily went out with Maya for the night. And all the other girls have plans. But her mom is home. We didn't [00:07:00] forget her mom is home decides to go take a bath. She makes Hannah a cup of tea She's like I'm going in the bath and at this point Hannah realizes that their back door latch is kind of broken and Of course, it's dark and raining the doors flying open and she goes upstairs and you see a dark figure head into her bedroom with muddy footprints on the floor in the kitchen and It ends up being Lucas, of course And Hannah's freaked out.
She's like, what are you doing here? He's like, you didn't let me explain. And it just so happens that she's holding the house phone, which was weird because she called Caleb on her cell phone. Yeah. I don't know where, where she got the house phone, but she ends up dialing on the site. She's like, has her arm straight down and she's dialing Caleb's number, hoping that he'll pick up or at least hear that Lucas is in the bedroom with her.
And I'm like, okay, but Caleb doesn't know Lucas is like dangerous. He probably would be very confused by it. And [00:08:00] also how
Michelle Rubinstein: convenient, like, Caleb's
Ilissa Daley: already in the house. Of course, right. So Hannah calls Caleb and says, like, she's apologizing and wishes they could make up and it's very convenient that Caleb does come over and he runs upstairs when Hannah calls him and He's like, what's going on here?
Like, Lucas, what the hell? Hannah, what the hell?
Michelle Rubinstein: But even still, Hannah doesn't act freaked out. She's just like, oh, Caleb, you're here. Like, obviously, she is like, sending a signal, but even when he enters, she's still like,
Ilissa Daley: Right, she's like, oh
Michelle Rubinstein: my god, thank you! She's still like, uh, defending Lucas in her own
Ilissa Daley: way.
Yeah, right and then Lucas has to make his big reveal and before he says that I go to Michelle I'm like, what's he gonna say cuz it's it's clear has nothing to do with a right right at this point at this point And he's like I just I brought you out to the lake because I needed to explain to you a secret of mine And I knew you I would if I could tell you then maybe you could lessen the blow with Caleb [00:09:00] So in my head, I'm like, well, maybe He just wants to tell Caleb he's so in love with Hannah and can't be his friend anymore.
Can't be his roommate anymore because he can't get
Michelle Rubinstein: over it. He can't
live
Ilissa Daley: with me anymore. Right. Yeah. It's not that. He actually had gambled his money away. Four thousand dollars. Plus Caleb's money. So I don't know how much money Caleb had saved, but in total Caleb ends up giving Lucas some of his savings to hold on to while he was visiting his mother.
And then that money, on top of Lucas's money, was used in a basketball bet and now he has no money left. So 4, 000, however, is lost and he's going to try and pay Caleb back. Caleb's so nice. Like, he's, he's disappointed. He's like, we'll make a payment plan. Like, I'll figure it out. It's just like this whole thing
Michelle Rubinstein: was because Lucas had a gambling
Ilissa Daley: issue.
Right. Right, it was so
Michelle Rubinstein: dramatic, like, Hannah, I'm gonna take you out on the boat. And I just have the way I mean, I get it. I [00:10:00] get why we did what we did. But like you look back and you're like he was so sinister. It's like someone possessed
Ilissa Daley: him Yeah and he's like I knew Emily knew it was me on the other line and I wanted to get to you to tell you at First and everyone's like no we thought you were like literally a serial killer yeah, we thought really bad things of you and It ends up being that he lost the money.
So Kat other people wanted to know did you feel this is anti climatic? Of course
Michelle Rubinstein: but But it makes so much sense for the show like of course it does yeah, of course like we
Ilissa Daley: were let's throw a red herring everywhere Which way that's it? Yeah, I had gotten a nice email from one of our listeners and our original a Kate Yeah, and she had sent me an email in regards to the podcast Bro's Watch PLL 2, and they had an episode with Brian [00:11:00] Holden, who directed this episode.
And in it, they talked about how they wanted to make Lucas gay. And they wanted this storyline, like Lucas taking her out on the boat, to be him trying to reveal to Hannah that he is gay. I'm like, why? Like, why? That would have been so much better. I'm just saying. What happened with that? I don't know. I didn't actually get a chance to listen to the episode before we recorded, but it will be on my list and we can link it below.
Yeah. Um, but I just thought that that was interesting. She said it's a really insightful episode for the show. Wow. Yeah. Yeah, I know, right? Like, what would we, what would we have done with that? It would have been so much better. Freaking gambling. I don't know why they went this way, but. Maybe they talk about it.
All right. So Spencer is snooping around her attic at the lake house and she finds some burner phones and an old receipt from around the time that Hannah and Caleb had spent the night at the lake house. And this receipt is from Smitty's in Philadelphia. [00:12:00] And so she decides her and Aria are going to go take a train into Philly and go to Smitty's.
And I'm like, Michelle, wouldn't you not just, you would just Google the address. You would just Google the address, look and see. I mean, I'm granted like it's very easy to do that now in 2024. Look on Google Maps and see what's around the area. Google the address. But at this point, you very well could have just googled it.
Yeah. But we had to go to Philly, which is fun to see them go to like at least a different part of the city. And so they head to the address, they find out Smitty's is a newspaper stand, and they're really not seeing anything out of the ordinary. Aria says, well maybe your parents came here, they work in the city, or maybe Melissa came here, she lives 10 blocks, like, it might just be nothing.
And so I'm just like, you're right, it's probably nothing. And then like, as soon as they got there, Aria's like, I gotta go. I gotta go meet Holden for my date, fake date. I mean,
Michelle Rubinstein: clearly, it's making us feel that like Philly's not that far away. Right. They caught a train in 20 minutes. Right. They were at school.
From school. They were looking at [00:13:00] the train schedule. They got on a
Ilissa Daley: train. And Aria says, I have to meet Holden at 730. Yeah, so like, this was just a, It's probably like an hour from Philly. Right. If that. If that. Yeah. So Aria ends up leaving and Spencer's like, yeah, I'm just gonna snoop around maybe a little bit longer and she ends up seeing a woman with a blind dog and then she sees a couple of other people with like walking sticks and she's walking and Following them because then she sees there's this entire blind rehab basically and so she says okay, this is interesting it's it the you know, The blind rehab of Philadelphia or whatever it is.
And so she goes inside Hoping to get some answers. So she asked the receptionist. Is Jenna Marshall a patient here? I've been gone for a while. Like this, the weird, the weird is so bizarre. I'm just looking for an old friend of mine. I know she went to blind rehab in Philadelphia. I didn't know which one and the woman's like, obviously I can't tell you anything.
But this [00:14:00] conversation is overheard by another person named Sam and he says, I know Jenna. So Spencer sits down, she has this conversation with him and he just tells her how Jenna was so great and she uplifted him after he was really depressed about going blind. And apparently his was genetic and it just, his vision degenerated throughout his life.
So he literally, as he said, saw it coming, which is so sad. And he said Jenna pulled him out of his funk and she was like really fast learning and really was just very agile and everyone. Liked her there and she got him interested in art So he sticks around to help out with the art classes, but Jenna left She said she had something to do in Rosewood.
And so she was gone. Yeah, and he hasn't seen her in a while He hasn't seen her and Spencer very purposely is like I don't know her from Rosewood because I don't want like any Association with Rosewood and he
Michelle Rubinstein: also says she's just [00:15:00] so good at reading
Ilissa Daley: people Yeah, and she teaches him, she taught him a lot of tricks.
Yeah. He read her pulse, felt if her pulse was very fast. Right. And so he's like whatever she was doing, I hope she found it. Like I hope she's happy and they leave and he leaves and Spencer is about to leave, but the woman says she has to sign in because every guest has to sign in. Mm hmm. And of course every single book from the last 20 years of signing.
Pages are on display at the front desk. It's so convenient. And so the woman at the receptionist, again, conveniently has to get, go into the back room. So Spencer just walks in the front, grabs the book from my, I'm assuming 2008, which is the year that Allie went missing and Jenna got out of rehab. And um.
Yeah, she takes it with her to bring and show the other girls to see who had signed in that year. And then the woman's
Michelle Rubinstein: like, thank you so much, and Spencer's like, thanks, but Spencer didn't sign anything. No, she didn't sign anything. Like not even a fake name. [00:16:00] Not
Ilissa Daley: even, right, not even a fake name. Yeah, frustrating, but you know, really weird.
That's how it goes. Of course. There's like no cameras either So Spencer she gets off the train. It's hard to tell where she even is at this point And so she's like in this very shady Train parking lot by herself in the dark. Come on girls. No, no, no, no, no Where is this in Rosewood? No clue. It has to be, I mean, her car was like parked along the side of like a main road.
I don't know. It was very strange. Yeah. Eventually she bumps into Mona because Mona was in Philly shopping. 'cause Nolan her did break up and she needed some retail therapy and she had to go alone because her and Hannah aren't speaking. And Spencer's like, let, can I just be candid? Be like, you are like Mona.
And you don't need a gnoll. Like you're so much better than him. Yeah, don't let him define you. So great. And Mona's like, you're not like just book smart, you're like smart smart. Like you're way [00:17:00] smarter than I realized. And they had a nice moment because you know in the past they definitely Yeah, have butted
Michelle Rubinstein: heads.
She said that Hannah wasn't answering her but Hannah said that like Mona was mad at her Yeah, so were they both just like not Catching each other at the right time.
Ilissa Daley: Probably it seems that way Yeah So she goes back to the girls and she shows them the sign in book and Garrett clearly had been there to visit her and he Signed her out But never signed her back in and this is apparently the night before Allie went missing and was killed and so they're wonder like what happened.
They also noticed that Allie didn't sign the book because Allie had told the girls that she had went to go see Jenna to make sure Jenna didn't say anything about her. Basically, I think. The girl's blinding her, right? I think that she like blackmailed her to tell her. I think so. So, who, uh, someone, someone made a story up.
Unless Allie just didn't sign her name. And so, Garrett and Jenna have been a thing for a while. For a while. Since 2008, [00:18:00] apparently. It's 2012. That's Oh, not, not good. They should stop giving us dates. Don't give us dates. No! Cause it's not looking good. Give us
Michelle Rubinstein: dates and be consistent or don't give
Ilissa Daley: dates.
Don't give dates at all. We'll live in a fantasy world as long as you don't give us any dates. Don't give us the dates. Don't give us one month, one week, one year. Don't give us that. Because, it doesn't make sense. Well, I mean, I
Michelle Rubinstein: guess we could think that maybe they weren't romantically involved
Ilissa Daley: but somehow.
Right, they could just be friendly. Like the N. A. T. club or whatever. Right. So the girls end up recovering, kind of like, after Lucas, and Aria comes back from her date, and Spencer at the rehab center, and they get some Chinese food, and of course the Chinese food is filled with worms and dirt from A as payback from when they tricked A in the last week's episode.
Yeah, it
Michelle Rubinstein: says now we're even, but like we know that's not [00:19:00] true because A will continue to torture. Right. I just like, didn't like A's text and
Ilissa Daley: You don't like A's text? No, I
Michelle Rubinstein: didn't like A's text and I just didn't like everything they did this episode. Not that we're rooting for A, but sometimes you're like, ha ha ha, right?
Or like, oh, that was good.
Ilissa Daley: Yeah. Sometimes you're like, oh, it worked out
Michelle Rubinstein: too conveniently this episode. I didn't like any of it. Yeah. Not the episode, just like A's
Ilissa Daley: part of it. Yeah, it's getting a little bit too old and convenient. It's
Michelle Rubinstein: too effing convenient for me right now. Agreed.
Ilissa Daley: Yeah. We want something that's like, oh, whoa, how'd they do that?
You know? Right, right, right. This is just, nah. All right, so on to Aria. Holden, who she had used as her alibi last week, is actually asking her out on a date this week. And she's like, that's so strange. Being that I told my mom I was going out with him and now I actually am going to go out with him. Yeah.
And it seems like [00:20:00] he likes her. Like they, he probably had a crush for a little bit and they were childhood friends, but now they're older. And so he asks her out and she's like, yeah, I'll plan the date. I'll fig, I'll figure out something for us to do. So she ends up buying. play tickets to an Arthur Miller play because she knows that Ezra once had tickets for the same play and if fate works on their side they will bump into each other.
So she's using Holden to hopefully see Ezra. So outside the theater, her and Holden meet up and he gives her a present of gummy bears and she's like, huh? Well, I'm a little confused about it. And he's like, yeah that time that you were smuggling in gummy bears and she's like Oh, yeah, your mom like was off sugar and it just was unnecessary dialogue and just yeah It's just to show that he cares, right?
And they have a history. He pays attention. He knows her And so at that point Aria goes to pick up the tickets and she asks if Fitz has picked up his [00:21:00] tickets and the person has said no and was going to give her his tickets, which I'm like, don't you need ID? ID! Right? Like anyone get to pick up the tickets?
Yeah, this person's ready to give everybody's tickets to her. And then Ezra comes out of the car and he sees her and he's like not happy to see her. He's like, oh shit, what do I do? I know I can't be around her. I don't want to, you know, make this any worse than it already is. And then Mrs. Welsh, who is, was friends with Ezra, was friends with Ella, she's one of the other teachers at Rosewood.
Is there and kind of distracts Holden and Aria and so Ezra goes inside and we find out he leaves within 10 minutes of being in the theater because he got sick, quote, and Mrs. Walsh is very upset. She's like, yeah, I felt so bad. He like, he just left and Aria is so devastated. Is this gonna be discussed with
Michelle Rubinstein: Ella?
Like, hey, what did you do over the weekend? Oh, I went to see an Arthur Miller play, Fitz. Remember Fitz?
Ilissa Daley: He gave me the ticket. Oh, you know what's weird? I saw it. I saw, uh, your daughter there and [00:22:00] Holden was there, too. What a good point. Like, what a fucking good point. Of course, you
Michelle Rubinstein: know, Aria's not gonna, she didn't know that Mrs.
Welch would
Ilissa Daley: be there, but like, No. It's almost like that art show situation where she almost got caught, but then Ella and Byron's car got broken down. Right, right, right, right. Yeah. Which, that was when Caleb, I remember that was the first Caleb bits when he slashed our tires or whatever, or, mm hmm, moved a part around.
Anyway, so, Holden catches on that Aria is devastated that Mr. Fitz had gone. He's like, I know you like him. It's very clear that you're disappointed that he didn't show or that he didn't, uh, you know, say hi to you, I guess. And he's like, we could continue to do this if you keep my secrets too. TBD with his secrets.
Right. Like, what are you doing
Michelle Rubinstein: next Friday?
Ilissa Daley: Right. Use each other. Let's just do this.
Michelle Rubinstein: I'm into this. I'm into having a [00:23:00] friend who you can mutually help. Like, I don't want her to use him.
Ilissa Daley: But I'm also We also don't want her to really date. I mean, maybe she could date him. He is her age, but I feel like it's way too soon.
No, no, no,
Michelle Rubinstein: no, no. But like, use each other for alibis and stuff. But like, what are his secrets? Are they even good? Probably not.
Ilissa Daley: Um, this character,
I remember, I know what happens with him. I don't remember how we, like, end it, but, um, I remember, I was like, when is this person coming? And I remember this one specific scene, there's a big, there's a gif of, or jif, however you say it. Of Lucy Hale and you'll see it when we reach the episode and they're playing um air hockey.
Okay, and she's like I'm like this it's used so much that I'm like, what is this episode and cuz her and Holden are playing anyway Got it. This is the one I think of Holden. That's all I think of. I'm like, what [00:24:00] was that happening? Okay And then we have Emily and Maya, who are really sweet and they're getting back into the groove of their relationship and they want to go out to some band in, uh,
Michelle Rubinstein: Jersey.
Jersey.
Ilissa Daley: With fake IDs. With fake IDs. And all the girls have a fake ID. Obviously. Obviously. And I'm like, yeah, of course. Like, of course I have one. And Maya's like, mine got taken away. Do you think you can get another one for me? And she's like, yeah, totally. I'm like, where is she going to get this fake ID?
Then she asked Aria, then she asked Aria for a fake ID from Maya and Aria's like, we look nothing alike. Hello, ma'am. Brunette, 5'2 Same thing. We're brunette and 5'2 What? I'm sorry. No. Emily. No. Girl. No. Anyway, so Maya's distracted a lot in this episode. She's On her phone and a couple of scenes and it doesn't seem to be positively [00:25:00] She's obviously a little she's distracted, but her tone changes very quickly And so Emily's like, is everything okay?
And she asked Hannah, like, what should I do in this situation? I don't know anything. What if it's A? What if A is bothering her or getting to her? And Hannah's like, you know, she'd let you know. I'm like, would she though? What if like A had something on her? She wouldn't tell anyone. Amaya? Yeah. Yeah, no. It's the same thing as like A blackmailing the other girls.
Like she wouldn't tell anyone. Right. Just like the girls are not telling anyone. They're being blackmailed. So finally she says to Emily, look, I have something I want to tell you. I feel like I should get it off my chest being that we're starting a new relationship. And she says, I did hook up with someone while we were separated, which.
You know, nice that she said that, like they weren't together. So it's okay. And then she says, he, and Emily's like, um, Um, [00:26:00] what? Yeah. He, she freezes. Yeah. He, he, yeah. Oh, I didn't know it was going like that. Uh huh. It's gonna be like that. Mm hmm. Yes. Yeah. And then our last scene, which Michelle was screaming, she's like, what the hell is a purpose on this scene?
And I was like, yeah, I know. We have a loosening some bolts. Is that what's happening? Yeah, basically on like a partition and we'll see the aftermath of that next week. Okay. So if you had to predict what was going to happen with that, I guess. First thoughts.
Michelle Rubinstein: I was like, we're back in the church clock tower for some reason.
I was like, second thought was like, Ooh, we're building a Dexter, like kill room because of like the plastic walls. And then after that, I'm like, this sounds like a music box
Ilissa Daley: because it was just like, ding. I know. I'm like, why do we have to just, it's so awkward. And we were fixated on
Michelle Rubinstein: it for like a little too long.
It was too long. I have, I don't even know what this is. I, [00:27:00] so you're saying he was loosening. They were loosening, unloosening, tightening. Loosening, unloosening. They were loosening. That doesn't make sense. Loosening
Ilissa Daley: bolts that were. Loosening bolts. Basically. What? Yep. Okay. I don't know why we had to do it. I do know why we had to do it because we'll see next week what happens with that.
Okay. Yeah. I don't even know where this could be. I have no idea. Mm hmm. Okay. Well, we're going to take a break and we'll be right back. We're gonna go into an MVP and shittiest, yes Okay, I'm do you have your me? I do. Okay, three two one Spencer. I was like, I will miss what miss Spencer
Michelle Rubinstein: Yes for the line. She delivered to Mona.
Yeah, I like you are better than that. Mm hmm, but Caleb it's funny when we were watching and We're having the Lucas scene. Lucas, Caleb, and Hannah, and he just came in from the rain. I wasn't really focusing, so I was like, I'm a little distracted. Like, Caleb looks so good. It's [00:28:00] a little moistened. He's got that green jacket on.
His hair is a little wet. I was like, I have
Ilissa Daley: to say, Lucas looks pretty nice wet, too. Sure. They
Michelle Rubinstein: all look nice, but Lucas, it's just Caleb. Caleb just, Caleb does.
Ilissa Daley: And he does it for you. I'm just like a really big fan of Caleb. I'm so happy. He's just so
Michelle Rubinstein: sweet. He's so sweet. The way he cared for Luca. Why'd
Ilissa Daley: you choose him?
I'm like speaking for you. No, for simply like, I'm worried about him. I want to help him. I'm like, I feel like I should help him. Right. And being mad like, Hannah, why aren't you telling me the truth? We don't keep secrets. Why are you doing this? Yeah, and
Michelle Rubinstein: times he's been saying that. He said it.
Ilissa Daley: Don't keep secrets.
One time she's not gonna tell him enough and he's gonna be done because it's gonna be too much for him when your partner doesn't tell you the truth. Mm hmm. Shittiest. Yes, I have one. Me too. Okay. Three, two, one, [00:29:00] Lucas. Nice. Lucas is
Michelle Rubinstein: obvious. For sure. I just. I get what Aria was doing with Holden, and I guess it all worked out in the end, but come on.
Ilissa Daley: Just like. Right? Like, of course it worked out. What if, like, you really hurt Luke, uh, Holden's feelings? Yeah.
Michelle Rubinstein: And then when they're like, when she was like. When they were in school figuring out what they're going to do and she's like, is this a date? And he's like, oh, it doesn't have to be a date. It could just be like a hangout.
Like, she should have just been like, yo, I want to be
Ilissa Daley: straight up with you. Right. She could have been like, you know, it's great if it's not a date because I'm just getting out of a relationship. Right. And
Michelle Rubinstein: also, we're old friends. Let's go get pizza and let me, like, catch you up to speed here. Right. Not this whole, like, Let me show up to Arthur Miller play and, Mm hmm.
Because Fitz
Ilissa Daley: might be there. Right, they could just hang out as friends and Yeah. Her parents wouldn't think anything of it. No. Because they are friends. That's right. And he's been gone for a while. But Lucas? [00:30:00] Lucas, just because, Yeah. He got wrapped up in the gambling and for being shady. So shady. But we get why he was shady, I mean, like, it was so dramatic.
It was so dramatic, writers, come on. I mean, looking back. I mean, I get it. Right. Looking back, it's like, really? This is why we did this? Right. It doesn't make sense. Like, you brought her out on the boat? You acted like you were gonna kill her. You acted like, right, like, don't say anything. If you were not so like, you could have just been like, so hey, and guess what?
Um, I'm in a really shitty situation, and I lost all of Caleb's money, I don't know how to tell him, can you help me lessen the blow? Right! That's all you had to say. Yeah. But, he was afraid. And it was scary. For everyone. Mmhmm. I wouldn't really highly rate this on a cringe. There was nothing that we really laughed out loud about.
No.
Michelle Rubinstein: I'm trying to think what we laughed at. I mean,
Ilissa Daley: honestly, it was just like, just [00:31:00] the stupid, the stupidness of like, oh really? That was Lucas's secret. Like, we left at that. And
Michelle Rubinstein: Yeah. And I like, was hooting hollering at the end, the screw or whatever. Like literally guys, if you were watching me, I was like,
Ilissa Daley: she's like, what?
Screaming, what is this? She's cracking up. 'cause I was like, I, I mean, literally what you see is what you get. That's what it is. I know. And I'm on the edge of my seat. Like, oh, what's happening? What's happening? And I was, I was like, that's it. That's all we're getting. That's all that's happening. What like.
Well, next week's episode, episode 17 of season 2, we are really making some, some progress. All right, so the title is The Blonde Leading the Blind. Okay. My secret. I've got a secret. I've got a secret. I've got a secret. Is that our Caleb [00:32:00] uncovers a video on Ace's phone of the NAT club.
I know it's so fun. Yeah, what do you think it's gonna be? Who's gonna be there?
Michelle Rubinstein: What's gonna be the video? Okay well Jenna's gonna be on that video. I think it's gonna be Jenna. Is Jason? Will we see Jason in video form, because he's probably
Ilissa Daley: not back? Yes. Yes. Okay. I think he might be. I don't remember now. I watched this episode so long ago.
He might be in next week's episode. Okay, so the NAT club.
Michelle Rubinstein: Mm. Jason,
Ilissa Daley: Garrett, Ian? As we know. As we know. So far. Potentially Jenna.
Michelle Rubinstein: Potentially, but Garrett, Ian, Jason. That's
Ilissa Daley: it so far.
Michelle Rubinstein: Okay, so maybe it's like the three of them sitting around. I wonder if we can hear what they're saying, though. I
Ilissa Daley: So he, we can hear it.
We can hear it. Yep. [00:33:00] Ew. I know. Oh my god, it's probably so
Michelle Rubinstein: gross what they talk about. I can only imagine. Oh gosh, I'm really excited for this. Yeah. So Caleb finds this video on A's phone. Yeah. Are the girls gonna tell Caleb whose phone this
Ilissa Daley: is? Well, they don't know whose phone it is. Yeah, but are they gonna be like He's gonna be, he's gonna be like, I think he's gonna be like, I know these people in here.
Right. So what's this
Michelle Rubinstein: about? Like, somebody needs to tell me
Ilissa Daley: something. Yeah. Yeah, he's definitely not gonna want anything. Please, please, please tell me. They're, he will, they have to kind of tell him something. They're gonna tell him
Michelle Rubinstein: something. So they're gonna fill him in a little bit. They're gonna find this.
And I, I actually do think Jenna's gonna be present for this. Or Garrett's gonna mention Jenna, he's gonna like, but then again, I'm like, for some reason cannot keep my timelines
Ilissa Daley: right? The show can't, so it's fine. Well
Michelle Rubinstein: no, the NAT club started before [00:34:00] Jenna went blind. So maybe Jenna actually isn't involved yet, so I think this
Ilissa Daley: might be pre Jenna.
Right. Because if. The N. A. T., well the N. A. T., so the timelines, again, the N. A. T. club, as we suspect, had started when that level, those kids were in high school, because it was in their graduating class yearbook. So that was well before Jenna came into town, because they're supposed to be 22, where we are right now.
Right. Right. But again, the timeline. Yeah. Okay. Who knows? No. But that. That. That. That. That. That. That. Could be right there. Jenna could be there, but
Michelle Rubinstein: that would, yeah, that would totally screw up everything. So, right. I take it all back. I don't think
Ilissa Daley: Jenna's a part of this or, but I didn't tell you when this video was taken.
Right. So if it's more recent than maybe Jenna is involved, it would be
Michelle Rubinstein: [00:35:00] weird for an old, old video from the time when they were in high school to be on a's phone. Mm-Hmm. . So I think it's maybe a current, yeah. Meeting. Mm-Hmm. of the mines. Mm-Hmm. . So Jenna's back in .
Ilissa Daley: There you go. She made up her mind. I'm throwing Jenna back in.
But yes, I mean, I like where your head's at because, you know, the N. A. T. club didn't maybe originally start with her, but maybe she did end up in there somehow. Yeah, and
Michelle Rubinstein: maybe when they watch this video, they're going to be like, oh my god, it's, wait a minute, but if, jeez, if Ian's in it, then it's not that recent.
Ilissa Daley: Although Ian just It's only been four months since he's been dead. Actually, it's probably been like three weeks since he's been dead. Who the hell knows how long Ian's been dead at this point. But How long has Ian been dead for? A month maybe. Maybe two months. We'll see. I know we
Michelle Rubinstein: got rid of our visual,
Ilissa Daley: like the timeline.
We should do [00:36:00] YouTube.
Michelle Rubinstein: Our green screen, we used to have like list created this beautiful background and it had all our heads and it's like, you know, red string. It was a lot. It was a lot. But like, there's a lot to look at. We need to go
Ilissa Daley: back to that because like, or like just bring it up, like, you know, we'll bring it up at like for a segment.
Like let's look at the timeline. There'll be at the timeline segment, but I actually need to look at it. We actually have to look at it, have to
Michelle Rubinstein: look at it because I'm, I can't keep my, my facts
Ilissa Daley: straight. I know. I'm hopeful that there's someone out there. that has done this due diligence of the timeline.
I'm sure they have. I'm sure they have. I'm sure it's been done many a times because everyone is confused about what the timeline is. Right, and
Michelle Rubinstein: I feel like I gave no good predictions there. I was just. No you did. You were
Ilissa Daley: like it's gonna be the N. A. T. club with Jenna or Jenna in the N. A. T. club. Okay, that and.
You said the videos are gonna be creepy
Michelle Rubinstein: and gross. They're gonna be creepy and Caleb's gonna want an explanation and that's it. [00:37:00] And I don't think Hannah's gonna give it to him. I think he'll have to go to one
Ilissa Daley: of the girls behind your back. You think one of the other girls will have to tell him. Yeah.
Yeah.
Michelle Rubinstein: Yeah, I think that's what's going to happen. Or maybe Lucas. I wonder what Lucas role from now on is. Just a kid who lost all the money.
Ilissa Daley: Yeah, I'm trying to think of when we see him again. I'm pretty sure he's not gone. That would be crazy! That would be crazy. No, I That would be nuts! No, I know he's not gone, but I'm trying to think of like actually when again do we see him.
Yeah.
Michelle Rubinstein: Okay. All right, I look forward to it. I look forward to, hey, Caleb's in the episode. I'm there.
Ilissa Daley: If Caleb is there, Michelle is there. I am there. Yeah, we're getting down to the, the end of the season. Yeah. Wow. Doesn't even feel, it feels like it's so far away, but when you look at the calendar, like when you look at the, I should say, when you look at the calendar, it seems far away.
But then you're like, well, it's only like nine more weeks. Yeah. Which is not that far. It's not. It's [00:38:00] freaky. It is. And then we'll be done with season two. And then we might have some fun summer stuff planned for you guys.
Michelle Rubinstein: Liss and I, guys, we're
Ilissa Daley: just going to tease it right here. All right, tease it, tease it.
Go, go, go. Liss,
Michelle Rubinstein: we've both been thinking like the same thing. It's so funny. And then Liss like had this light bulb moment and she sent it my way and we have a really fun thing planned for our Patreon come summertime, like.
Ilissa Daley: It's Pretty Little Liars related.
Michelle Rubinstein: Yes, of course. This is a Pretty Little Liars podcast.
Lars. Lars. Pretty Little Liars. But stay tuned we're gonna iron out the details and I'm really excited for this. Me too.
Ilissa Daley: Yeah, this is good.
Well, as you know if you're an old TV listener It's Thursday over here. You know what that means. The boys are here. It smells like they got White Castle. I smelled french fries or something. They're making weird noises because they're playing D& D. So we're gonna go and see what's going on. And we'll be back next [00:39:00] week for The Blonde Leading the Blind.
Think about the title maybe? Then
Michelle Rubinstein: I was like, Allie with Jenna, Hannah with Jenna, but I think it's Allie with Jenna and maybe we find other videos on there.
Ilissa Daley: Nice. Yes. Yes. That's where my head's at. All right. To be continued.
Michelle Rubinstein: Thank you so much for listening to We Are Liars, a Pretty Little Liars podcast. You can email us at weareliarspod at gmail.
Ilissa Daley: com. If you'd like to leave us a voice message or just say hi, we have a voicemail, 631 600 3333. If you haven't already and you're loving the show, please consider giving us a rating and
Michelle Rubinstein: review. This has been a Total Betty Podcast. Produced and edited by Michelle Rubinstein and Ilissa Daley. Music by Anthony Viccora.